WWE Payback (April 30, 2017) -- Results and Afterthoughts

Payback (2017) was a professional wrestling pay-per-view (PPV) and WWE Network event, produced by WWE for the Raw brand. It took place on April 30, 2017 at the SAP Center in San Jose, California. It was the fifth event in the Payback chronology. Due to the Superstar Shake-up, the event included two interbrand matches.

Eight matches were contested at the event, including one match on the pre-show. In the main event, Braun Strowman defeated Roman Reigns. On the undercard, Bray Wyatt defeated Randy Orton in a House of Horrors match and Seth Rollins defeated Samoa Joe to end his undefeated streak since joining the main roster. The event also saw two titles change hands: Chris Jericho defeated Kevin Owens to win back the United States Championship, thus transferring Jericho to the SmackDown brand, and Alexa Bliss defeated Bayley to win the Raw Women's Championship, becoming the first woman to hold both the Raw Women's Championship and SmackDown Women's Championship.

We (Serena, my on-and-off again occasional co-author and collaborator on this blog and myself) wanted to do something different for this write-up and decided to write this one together since we had the rare opportunity to watch the event live together (despite our time zone and nationality differences) and comment about it.

Serena: Well, since ZX refused to watch the pre-show, I (with my still free WWE Network subscription), decided to take one for the team and suffer through all by myself. Which was a surprise all on its own, since I hate those kickoff panels to the very core of my being. But we can discuss that on some other fun occasion. So what did happen during that one hour before the official “Payback” card took place?

Enzo Amore and Big Cass vs The Club (Karl Anderson & Luke Gallows)

This one was… How to put it… Ummm… Decent? No, in all honesty, the match was fine. Gallows and Anderson carried out the entire thing, smartly cornering off the obviously less athletically gifted Enzo, Cass jumps in for a quick distraction/save and Enzo pins Anderson. A mediocre match even for your standard Raw. Enzo is probably one of the most annoying wrestling characters that I’ve seen in awhile, because it always looks like he just doesn’t do anything, but just gets in the way and ends up in a predicament that requires Cass to go out of his way to save him. He is Barbara Keen from the first season of “Gotham”. And even if in the end Cass and Amore needed the win to keep afloat, I still feel deep down that The Club do not deserve to be in a kickoff match with Snooki’s stunt double and, well… Big Cass (Sorry, didn’t know what bad to say about him.)

Sasha Banks on the Kickoff panel with Renee Young and Jerry “The King” Lawler

Right after the promo package for the Raw Women’s Championship match between the defending Bayley and the contending Alexa Bliss, Sasha came out in support of her BFF and fellow Horsewoman and chat on the kickoff panel. Yet, what was a great opportunity to throw clever hints at a possible heel turn or even make a strong statement in regards to the newcomers Mickie James and Alexa Bliss (both drafted from Smackdown during the Superstar Shakeup), Sasha came out with generic “Wrestling Babyface Defense 101” and seemed beyond boring and stiff. Of course, this was just a short little gig, but knowing that Sasha is portrayed as the best this business has to offer, her mic skills either are just one big lie or simply plummeted during last year.

Miz TV w/ Special Guest - Finn Balor

There are two wrestling skits that annoy most of the viewers and are probably the easiest to predict outcomes for: contract signings and talk shows. And this one didn’t really break the mould or invent the wheel. But, what we did get was a few witty jabs and a way to book Finn strong, yet still like a babyface. Firstly, after Balor Club’s own made his overly extended entrance (gave me enough time to wash the dishes, not even joking), the Miz was quick to react: “Thank you, for that 5 minute entrance.”. The full long version of Balor’s entrance only works if he is sporting his Demon gimmick (which, to my personal sadness, he rarely does these days). Then the tense feeling that the music creates fits with the big reveal of Finn’s body paint, as he emerges crawling through the smoke, and lets you soak in the theatricality of it all. But, if he is walking out in jeans and a leather jacket, the long version makes no sense and just seems like WWE needed to fill in dead air somehow.

During this segment we established that Finn wants the WWE Universal Championship back, that he is probably a tad afraid of Brock, since for some reason he never mentions his name (only the Miz did throughout the entire thing). Exchanging insults, Finn was about to leave the ring, right after he noted that Miz doesn’t even deserve to get beaten up, since we all know how these arrangements usually end (we see you, trying to break that 4th wall). Miz threw a fit, screaming how could he not be worthy… Then, Slingblade and a dropkick into the corner. Miz is once again embarrassed in front of his wife and Finn walked out like a confident babyface. He showed that he is the bigger man, yet still can stand up for himself.

At this point, Finn’s direction is clear: Brock and the title. Possibly even Braun Strowman (having Khali vs anyone on the roster flashbacks), since he is also currently in the title picture. As for the Miz… I do hope that he will one day get a “At Least You Tried” induction into the Hall of Fame.

Just for you, Miz.

United States Championship Match - Chris Jericho def. Kevin Owens (c); Owens is back on RAW and Jericho is officially part of SD Live roster as a result

ZX: Yeah I didn’t want anything to do with watching the pre-show after reading that line up. Sorry for putting you through that misery, Serena.

As for this match, I can’t really complain too much here. I think the podcaster Solomonster said it best about Owens’ ring work though, “You can’t call Dean Ambrose too lazy without admitting that Owens is the King of the Chinlock.” Goddammit, he’s spot on about that too. Owens just seems to coast on his early standout performances from his debut year and just seems to be dialing it in here against Jericho. Then again, between PPVs and house shows they’ve prolly done this match-up so many times that they are probably as sick as we are watching it. You know how I feel about Jericho already, but I’m ready for him to take another break. He’s a shoe in to be a future Hall of Famer without a shadow of a doubt, but I haven’t been too entertained with him as a character since 2008ish. He can still put on great matches with a lot of the younger guys, but I honestly wouldn’t buy a ticket to see him wrestle if I’m perfectly honest. I have to wonder how much longer Jericho is going to keep doing this to himself and to his overall legacy.

That being said, I’m fine with him picking up the win here if he was going to drop the title to someone else other than Owens on SmackDown! Live, but after reading the spoilers for RAW and SD this week, that didn’t happen, so I’m going to sit back here and facepalm. I was honestly looking forward to Jericho being on SmackDown for once.

I was hoping we would’ve gotten an AJ Styles/Jericho rematch on SD at Backlash but that’s not happening since the Hungry-Hungry Hippo got the US title back…

Serena: I don’t really have that much to say about the match, if to be honest. I’ve been on a huge “WhatCulture Wrestling” kick lately and the guys there were absolutely in love with this bout. Yet, when we watched it live, I thought that it was a bit slow as it looked like Owens was quite sluggish the entire time. And we all know that he has the physical capabilities to wrestle at a quick pace. But it did pick back up as it progressed. I actually quite enjoy Jericho in his current run and was quite devastated to see both him dropping the belt later on and especially to Owens. I really, genuinely hoped that they won’t do that “New Face of America” gimmick. But, f**k my luck, a clean shaven, suit wearing Kevy, that little tinker, is gonna be the new face of wrestling. Someone pass me the gun, please...

ZX: I thought he was going to be the new face on the Hungry Man frozen TV dinners…

Serena: He’s gonna be the new face of “Jenny Craig”.

ZX: (Busts out laughing) Dammit, almost made me spit Mountain Dew all over my keyboard.

Cruiserweight Championship Match - Austin Aries def. Neville (c) via disqualification; Neville retains title as a result

ZX: Aries v. Neville at WrestleMania 33 was one of the only matches that I was honestly looking forward to on that match card this year and they let me down with the lackluster finish to that bout. I was hoping that they would remedy that mistake here, but nope, we get another lame duck finish. The fact that the referee was laughing and couldn’t stay in character should have been grounds to fire him if this was still the old territory days of wrestling. It’s just stupid and unprofessional calls like that really take me out of the moment and absolutely ruin matches for me.

I don’t know what they are waiting on with all of these “close but no cigar” finishes for Neville to retain and Aries goes home empty-handed. If they don’t want Aries to be champion yet, there’s more than enough guys to drag out Neville’s title reign on 205 Live until they want to pull the trigger on that.

Serena: Honestly, I feel that Neville works on a much higher level as a heel. He knows what to say and when to say it, knows what tone to use. Also, I like his attitude towards TJ Perkins: “You can help me, yet we all still know that you will try to backstab me.”. Aries, who is a stellar worker, actually doesn’t really have a personality in this feud. He’s a tweener at best. But, still, the guys have good chemistry, their styles match beautifully. And with all of this going for them the match was “meh”. It wasn’t bad, not at all. Solid match, but I wouldn’t say that it was my favorite. Also. I didn’t really mind the finish, as I think about it now. Neville is the sneaky heel, who will do everything in his power to keep the title. Lie, cheat and steal.

ZX: Yeah, there were far worse things on this card than this match in terms of overall quality. It was just the finish that bothered me the most. I think we discussed this on multiple occasions now, but in terms of Aries’ character, I feel that he’s just coasting on what worked for him in TNA/Impact Wrestling, much like Bobby Roode, Eric Young, and Samoa Joe. That’s a huge reason why those guys absolutely bore me in terms of anything that involves me having to watch them do in-ring segments or on the microphone. In Aries’ case, he stands out though on 205 Live as he has a better personality than the bland gimmicks the rest of those guys have on that show. Going heel was the best thing that could have happened to Neville. I wanted them to pull that trigger on him back on NXT when he was feuding with Sami Zayn but they never did it. I’m glad we’re finally getting treated to what he can do in that role now.

Serena: The difference between the rest of the cruiserweight division (who names I can’t even imagine. Seriously, I know T.J., Neville and Aries.) is that Aries can be without any gimmick whatsoever and still deliver on the mic, since he has charisma to spare. And that is a rare one these days. Guys like him and Jericho, like Punk, they can work the room like nobody's business.

RAW Tag Team Championship Match - The Hardy Boys (c) def. Cesaro & Sheamus; Cesaro and Sheamus attack Hardys and go heel post-match

ZX: I don’t know about you but if you have seen one Hardys’ match in the past 3-5 years then you have seen them all and this one wasn’t nothing different for me. That buzz of nostalgia already wore off for me with them here in WWE just like I knew it would fizzle out. I’m wondering how long it’s going to last until the rest of the WWE Universe feels the same way.

Serena: I do agree that the nostalgia wore off quickly. But I liked the match. Very much so. Probably, this was one of my favorites. I always enjoy seeing the Hardy’s as tag team. And in this case, they were working with Cesaro and Sheamus, two guys that I think work wonders with each other. As much as I was rooting for Cesaro to finally get a proper main event push, I can’t deny the fact that he looks great in a tag team setting. Plus, I was so happy with the way they turned them heels. Handshakes, respect and only after a few matches this was made into a heel turn. Also, Sheamus works so much better as a heel. His first segment on Raw after Payback proves my point.

ZX: Cesaro isn’t a strange to tag team wrestling. If I can be selfish, I want them to call up Kassius Ohno (Chris Hero) for we can have the Kings of Wrestling tag team in a WWE environment, but that’s just me. There were a lot of cool spots in this match and both teams here definitely have chemistry with each other. I just get bored with obvious finishes - WWE wasn’t going to take the belts off the Hardys this soon. I’m with you though on the heel turn by Cesaro and Sheamus though. Sheamus is so much better as a heel instead of attempting to be a babyface and failing BADLY at it. It’s going to be a tough sell for Cesaro as a heel as it’s so easy to cheer that guy when he’s easily one of the best pure wrestlers in the company, but he’s pulled it off in the past.

I just have to wonder how long they are going to allow Matt Hardy to keep ‘acting’ like he’s doing the Broken stuff before actually pulling the trigger on it in WWE. Last time I checked, WWE and Anthem haven’t agreed on anything and the lawsuit against the Hardys is still active.

Serena: I decided to Google that one and as announced by wrestlingnewsworld.com, WWE and Anthem struck a deal on April 25th. So maybe that is why Matt and Jeff during Raw finally showed a clear sign of the Broken gimmick: the “Delete” gesture.

ZX: Then that’s just wonderful then…

RAW Women's Championship Match - Alexa Bliss def. Bayley (c); becomes first woman to win both RAW and SmackDown! Women's Championships

ZX: Bayley did a great job of carrying Alexa Bliss through this match, but there wasn't a second that I believed that Bayley was walking out of this match with the title. Whenever WWE has put an emphasis on making history, 9 times out of 10 it happens in favor for the heels. Plus, unspoken rules of wrestling state that the babyface has to lose in their hometown. That's just a given - it adds TONS of heat for the heel.

With WWE going on the road towards Summerslam for the next few months, it makes more sense to have RAW's top two female babyfaces (Bayley and Sasha Banks) in the chase for the title instead of actually holding it as champions.

Plus let's be honest here... Out of all of the women on RAW (outside of maybe Mickie James), Bliss is the best talker, especially in a division that is lacking Charlotte right now. You want proof? Look no further on how she owned that crowd who were chanting "What?" at her last week.

That being said, Bliss could benefit in this role as she can hopefully get more comfortable working with the women on RAW as her in-ring ability isn't that much to write home about.

Serena: Honestly, not much for me to say, since Xion hit the nail on the head. Was really surprised, yet really happy that Bliss took the belt off Bayley. She had become really stale recently and as we now know, she is quite awful on the mic. Probably, one of the worst on the current roster, sharing reigns with Dana Brooke. Also, kill me for this one, but I loathe most of her moveset. Not all of it, but just as a worker, I don’t like her style in the slightest. So all hail the new Champ Little Miss Bliss and hope that she will keep improving and giving us more amazing promos and eventually - amazing matches.

ZX: Careful, you might piss off the Blissfits out there… I hope she improves in-ring for the better too. If she’s going to be leading the Women’s Division on RAW then she better rise up to the occasion.

House of Horrors Match - Bray Wyatt def. Randy Orton after interference by Jinder Mahal and Bollywood Boys/Singh Brothers

Serena: ROFL-copter.

ZX: The first half of this match was a pre-taped segment, clearly filmed elsewhere as it was still daylight in that area of the United States, but WWE expected people were supposed to buy into this for suspension of disbelief... And it's shit like this is why people wonder why do I have a problem with WWE insulting my intelligence when I watch this shit. I was immediately taken out of the moment when I saw how clean this house was. Bray Wyatt is supposed to be the "Eater of Worlds" and the "New Face of Fear", yet he lives in a cleaner house than most people I know! What followed was stupider than the WCW King of the Road Match and the "Hardcore Invitational" from WCW Bash at the Beach 1999 combined, yet for some reason, WWE thought it was a good idea to split this match up into two parts for we can "believe" that Wyatt had time to drive back to the arena.

Serena: This was bloody awful. So awful that I couldn’t stop laughing the entire time. That pre-taped part was a gem that all year-end lists will mention and the match will be in our hearts for years to come. I still can’t stop thinking that Bray prepared this house for the match. Putting together twigs and doll heads, smearing dirt on his fridge and writing down his catchphrases on it. Setting up red lights and a good recording system, so that we could hear every nose hair that Randy possesses amplify the sound of his breathing. That shaky cam, those quick cuts.... And after all of that nonsense, after throwing the fridge on Randy (which wasn’t that big to be honest), Bray just sits back into the limo and asks for the driver to make the quick and easy drive from Richmond, Virginia (where the house is apparently located) to San Jose, California. Piece of cake drive to be honest. Pop a coffee and you’re there.

ZX: I’d love to be on WWE Creative and listen to that conversation that came down to all of this being decided on that it was a great idea. I happened to know a few people who were at the arena live and they said the live crowd was booing the crap out of that during the video that we were watching from home on the Network. Want to know what’s even funnier about that house they shot this in? It’s actually up for sale!

I really want to know who actually thought that anything in that house was scary. If they wanted to scare me, they could’ve just had Nicole Bass and Mae Young in their topless with Big Daddy V without a shirt on and that would’ve been enough to make me turn away in fear.

I gotta ask since we never talked about this yet, but how do you feel about Jinder Mahal and this massive push that he’s getting right now?

Serena: After the match continued in the arena and turned into your standard bout, I was like: “Well this went from awful to mediocre quick.”. But I had this stupid feeling that something was still about to happen. And there pops Jinder with two guys, both added together pretty much reaching Randy’s shoulder. The match ended and I started laughing hysterically: “The Eater of the Worlds” just won his own House of Horrors match with the help of Jinder Mahal, who up to this point was a jobber at best, and those two knuckleheads that follow him around.

But if talking about the push… Hate the gimmick (and no, I don’t hate him, because he is a heel, I hate the generic gimmick), hate the whole title stealing and simply can’t get behind him. I’ll give him 6 months and he will disappear in the lower midcard. Plus, just to add another stroke to the painting, I am very upset that the heel heat he gets is mostly created from the fact that he is a foreigner. With the current political atmosphere in the world, these kinds of outdated stereotypes are surely not helping us.

ZX: Not to mention… they gave him the same gimmick as one of the Indian heels on 205 Live from what I’ve heard from a lot of podcasts last week. The whole “You don’t like me because I’m not from here” cliche. At least Rusev actually tried with his whole “evil foreigner” gimmick. These guys are just recycling what worked for Muhammad Hassan and Daivari before they got released. I seriously doubt that Jinder’s going to take this as far as Hassan did in terms of heel heat, but yeah… this will be a flash in the pan. From what I heard and read, WWE are going with pushing him and the Bollywood Boys because they are trying to get a bigger audience in India for their upcoming tour. If that’s the case, do like TNA did a few years ago and do a separate show (Ring Ka King in TNA’s case - most of it is actually online on YouTube and partially in English) featuring a bunch of their native talent and have some other names as guest stars. That would get over better than just setting these guys up for failure in the long haul. I guess they haven’t learned their lessons from Dolph Ziggler’s repeated pushes only to fail at every opportunity.  

Serena: I heard those rumours as well. I get the marketing ploy: give someone they can relate to and they will buy (Culture Theory 101), but Jinder is simply not good enough to build an entire international brand on. Remember The Great Khali and the effort WWE put into use him for new relationship deals in India? How did that turn out? Khali was released, most of his matches are the laughing stock of reviewers & podcasters and now he owns a training facility in India.

ZX: Building a marketing empire off Khali was like trying to remove the smell from a piece of shit. It wasn’t happening.

Serena: To sum up this match, I can only say one thing that reflects on everything we’ve seen… Ghost tractor.

ZX: More like dumpster fire...

Seth Rollins def. Samoa Joe

ZX: Is it just me or did it feel like we already saw this match? I dunno what it was but it just felt like they mashed up Rollins’ bout with Triple H from WrestleMania with any one of Joe’s matches with Balor or Nakamura from NXT. Not a bad match, but it seemed like they were holding back at bit. Joe and Rollins definitely aren’t strangers to facing each other since they did face each other in ROH prior to coming to WWE.

Serena: I do have to admit two things before commentating on this match. First of all, I don’t really have a lot of background knowledge about Seth’s or Joe’s work in the indies. I know bits and pieces, but nothing too much. Also, I am quite fond of “The King Slayer” Seth Rollins. His gimmicks always somehow connects with me and I very much enjoy his in ring style. But, I agree that the match wasn’t really something to write home about. I do think that for some reason Joe forgot to sell some of the offense by Rollins and some of the moves even came off as slightly botched, mostly the stuff that happened ringside. For example, that downgraded version of a suicide dive by Seth.

But my biggest issue with this match was the fact that we are still playing the “injured knee” narrative with Seth. Sure, I understand, his legs are now a weak spot and Rollins already blew his knee out more than once. But we did this whole spiel with Triple H before Mania, we had the “face will prevail and overcome the odds” at Mania, but to continue pushing that same narrative into Payback and possibly further down the feud road between Samoan Joseph and Rollins seems silly in the slightest.

But, in the end, the match was a fun watch, nothing to really complain about. And, I really enjoyed the finish. It booked Seth once again as the Architect and Joe didn’t lose and credibility or “big strong man” points. So, kudos on that one, guys.

ZX: My biggest gripe here is the lack of selling by Rollins at certain points. Joe’s working your legs but yet you can still hit the high-flying offense no problem? OK, whatever… Just small stuff like that annoys me sometimes.


Braun Strowman def. Roman Reigns; post-match attack leaves Reigns "injured"

Serena: Well, first of all, the heat that Roman gets from the crowd is wasted with him being a face. Some heels don’t get such a wicked response even if they tried. Yet, every single time The Big Dog enters the building it seems like the WWE Universe will boo the poor chap out to Impact Wrestling. Also, was it just me or did everyone else also got the hint that Reigns taped almost as much as the Yeti (Z, be proud of me knowing old school wrestling references for a joke) might be losing this bout?

I do have to admit that I am not the biggest fan of the classic “David vs Goliath” scenario in professional wrestling, mostly because the bigger guys tend to rely mostly on their height and weight advantages, not doing much in ring wise. That is why Strowman “flipping over” the ambulance wasn’t something I found to be that amazing, since it is pretty much playing to that same “Big Guy/Monster” schtick we’ve seen a million and one times. But that is just met. One thing that I can admit is that Reigns and Strowman actually have quite a solid chemistry and you can feel the anger between these two wrestlers.

The match had some pretty cool spots, showing both the menacing strength of Braun, who managed to ragdoll even a man of Roman’s size and stature, but also the resilience and determination of the “injured” Reigns. Who, to be quite honest, has less and less face traits as time goes on. I don’t know if it’s WWE trying to remedy his current situation, but these days The Big Dog is more of a tweener. But even with that aside, seeing Braun on Reign’s shoulders and then hitting the mat via Samoan Drop is truly something to remember. The ending of the match was something everybody was waiting for, as Strowman needed a win to solidify his current main eventer status (plus, WWE is most probably saving him for Brock). Yet, I am not entirely sure if it was scripted in some way or not, but Roman spitting out blood really gave quite a fright, since we all know that PG-era WWE is not too fond of that red liquid on screen. Hope that the guy is doing well.

ZX: (Laughs) Yes, I’m VERY proud of you of that old school reference of the Yeti, Serena. I’ve been teaching you well. I don’t know everything, but I’m willing to learn what I don’t know.

As for this match, I have to admit I was honestly wasn’t paying much attention to it live. I had to rewatch it recently and I’m inclined to agree with you. I was more impressed with this match as it exceeded my expectations as I was thinking that we were going to get the same thing that we got for the last few months of this feud with Strowman laying it in on Reigns, only to come up short. If their leaked photos of on vacation together (with other WWE Superstars) overseas don’t tell the tape already, but those two really like working with each other and it shines in their work here.

All in all, I thought that was a fine way to end the show since that big muscle-bound goof Lesnar wasn’t going to waste one of his limited appearances defending his title on this show. I’d love to know what’s the kayfabe explanation how he’s able to exploit not having to abide by the 30-day compete clause for champions in wrestling. They can’t say it doesn’t exist as Naomi had to forfeit the title before WrestleMania when she got hurt, so they’ve definitely shot themselves in the foot in that aspect.

Overall, not the best PPV, but far from the worst that they've done since this brand split if I'm perfectly honest.